White boxer breedings - Page 3

**gmacleod** · #25 29th September 2004, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kassa

Well, the Kennel Club certainly considers them 100% boxers

As do most, if not all, governing bodies around the world

I know bobtails issued with a certified export pedigree by the KC are accepted as purebred boxers by the governing bodies in European and Scandinavian countries, the US and New Zealand - it would be surprising if Australia were to take a different stance (although I haven't yet explicitly read their rules on the subject).

bommy · #26 29th September 2004, 03:32 PM

I didnt know if they were or werenot recognised yet...i just meant it as an example..how the first few generations were not recognised...now that they are it is good...i know when i first came across them on the net they were trying to get them recognised...

after all a boxer with a naturally short tail it's what we need here seeing as we can not dock!

mara806 · #27 10th January 2005, 11:22 AM

It seems that many people have different opinions on the white dogs. My dog is white, and other than having almost too much energy to handle, there's nothing wrong with her. So theoretically, if she were to breed with lets say a plain boxer, would she have any white puppies? Is breeding of white boxers even allowed? She's registered now, so would they deny her the right to breed? I know it's been done before, and if the puppies wouldnt be used for showing but just for pets, what would be the harm in it? Just wondering.

**gmacleod** · #28 10th January 2005, 12:06 PM

If she were to "theoretically" be bred, she would very likely produce deaf puppies. Rather a more important consideration than their colour, don't you think?

If you actually read the information presented at the beginning of this thread by Marimat - and that is scientific fact, not a lay opinion - it would be patently obvious why white boxers should never be bred. Put simply, whether they are themselves deaf or not, their offspring very likely would be whether coloured or not. As Dr Strain stated "Breeding these dogs back into the boxer gene pool will very likely increase the overall incidence of deafness in ALL boxers (white or otherwise)." THAT is "what the harm in it" is.

Deliberately breeding a known defect into a dog breed is irresponsible in the extreme.

Frankly, I find it incredible that you are putting this issue in terms of a dog having a "right to breed". Dogs don't have rights to breed - they have (or should have) the right to be treated as loved pets and companions by owners who have put the best interests of their pet as the primary consideration. Well, being bred is not in the best interests of anyone's pet. It's a significant risk to their health.

What I think you really mean is that YOU just want to breed your dog. And ethics or the good of the breed be damned, you imagine you have a right to breed her. Well, breeding isn't a right, it's a responsibility.

95% of boxers, of any colour, should never be bred. They're the lucky ones. Your white bitch should be one of them.

mara806 · #29 10th January 2005, 02:21 PM

Thanks for your reply. I'm a little offended that you think I dont care about the breed or about my dog. I didnt mean to make you upset by asking the question; once again I'm new here and I dont know EVERYTHING like some people.

**gmacleod** · #30 10th January 2005, 02:38 PM

All the information anyone who cared about the health of the breed would need to understand that whites shouldn't be bred is at the beginning of this thread. Yet you still asked what would be the harm would be. And whether her "right" to be bred could be denied... Only two possible conclusions: either you don't care, or you didn't bother to read this thread before challenging it.

mara806 · #31 10th January 2005, 02:41 PM

Please dont be mad at me for asking this, but I read the entire thread of messages and I still don't understand one thing. If she were bred to a homozygous dominant plain boxer there would be no chance of white dogs being born, right? White is a recessive trait and would only show up if the other dog carried the same trait. I DO care about my dog and she will not be bred... I just wanted to know.

**gmacleod** · #32 10th January 2005, 03:05 PM

Sure, but the trick would be identifying the homozygous dominant. See this post: White boxer breedings

But whether or not any puppies are born white isn't the issue. Not breeding white boxers isn't about not producing more whites - they will continue to be produced in large numbers by the breeding of flashy with flashy. The issue is deafness - which is a genetically inherited condition. The offspring of white boxers, whether coloured or white, have a higher risk of deafness than the offspring of coloured dogs. And as it is genetically inheritable, the offspring of those puppies, in turn, will have higher risk... See this post: White boxer breedings

mara806 · #33 10th January 2005, 03:10 PM

I thought the deafness was caused by lack of melanin in the ears of the white boxers? but i'll take your word for it.

**gmacleod** · #34 10th January 2005, 03:29 PM

You've no idea how happy that makes me.

But don't take my word for it. You're a biology student, read these instead:
White boxer breedings
http://www.steynmere.com/DALM_DEAFNESS.html (the white colour in boxers is also due to the sw allele)

Upstatestuff · #35 1st April 2005, 11:11 PM

So I thought that the white boxer couldn't be registered? Also what is considered a white boxer anyway? Completely white? Or is it like 3/4 or more of the body is white? Just curious...

JulieM · #36 2nd April 2005, 10:08 AM

The Kennel Clubs (American and Canadian, and at least some in FCI countries - not sure about Australia/New Zealand/UK) will register white Boxers. The Boxer Clubs have Codes of Ethics/Conduct which prohibit or limited it. In the US, the American Boxer Club has just (9/04) change their Code of Ethics to allow breeders to give Limited Registration on spayed/neutered whites; it is law that a purebred dog in Canada is able to be registered, so Canadians have been able to register them for years but the Boxer Club of Canada requires they are spayed/neutered first.

As far as the standard/disqualification and Codes of Ethics go, "white" is really any dog with more than 1/3 white. Generally speaking, a dog with slightly more than 1/3 would probably be called "overly flashy"; a dog with 2/3 or more would be calld "white". That in-between is sometimes called "parti-colored" or "check" - but is not very common, in North America at least.