We've got crate issues

[LovinRuby]

Originally Posted by CondoPup

Have you tried classical music or leaving a TV on?
(I know someone who leaves the "animal planet" channel on for her dogs when she leaves the house. Ridiculous, I'm sure, but hey - she feels it works, and they probably pick up on her cues or something.)

We do leave a radio on for her, not classical. Just this station whose motto is "We'll play anything" (and they do). I tried talk radio too for a few days, but I didn't see any difference. Thought maybe voices would be better than music, but I guess not. Maybe I should try classical as it might be soothing. She can't see the TV from her crate or I would give the Animal Planet a try!

Originally Posted by CondoPup

Another suggestion is when she poops outside where she's supposed to, treat and praise her happily and thoroughly for positive reinforcement. Make sure to do this within mere seconds of her pooping so she knows exactly why you're praising her!

We always do give her alot of praise for doing her business outside. She doesn't usually want a treat then, but we give her lots of lovin' for being good. She knows that she is to go outside for potty. She's really quite good at it and goes to the door to let us know. (We're thinking about starting will the bell training so we will be sure to know when she wants to go.) I can't remember the last time she had an accident in the house, other than inside the crate.

[LovinRuby]

Originally Posted by digiboxers

you dont have another dog, do you?

No, no other dogs, just a cat. I don't think she's much comfort to Ruby when she's locked in her crate. For all we know the cat sits outside the crate and antagonizes poor Ruby when she knows the dog can't get her! Who really knows what goes on when we're gone!

[LovinRuby]

Originally Posted by Maggie'sMom

It sounds like you are trying everything. If it were me, I would at some point treat it as an anxiety just like people have anxieties. Heck I've been off and on anti depressents for years now. Not that you want to, but if it gets really bad, and you dont want another dog for company....My friend tried this med for her puppy 2 years ago. You could ask your Vet but I'm sure you would try everything first. I am not one to promote the easy way out and use meds but if all else fails... why should poor Ruby go through this anxiety? And what you are going through. I hope no one gets offended by suggesting meds but I would only do it as a last resort.

If this continues too much longer, we might have to consider meds. As much as I wouldn't want to do that, I can't be healthy for her to get that worked up everyday either. We mentioned her crate issues to the vet when we were there last week with her, but he didn't seem too concerned. He pretty much had the "she'll get over it" attitude. But if this goes on for a really extended length of time or she starts hurting herself again trying to get out, then we will have to discuss meds as an option.

I saw some aromatherapy thing called Comfort Zone when I was looking for something else in the pet aisle at Farm 'n Fleet yesterday. I am wondering if there is any merit to that? I'll have to do a search here to see if anyone has any opinions or feedback on it. We're willing to try just about anything at this point.

[LovinRuby]

Originally Posted by SammiRajah

...Sammi, on the other hand, when we first got her she had to be crated for about 8-9 hours. EVERYDAY we had a mess to clean up. We tried everything!!! This happened every single time we left her in the crate until she was about 9 months old. Then until she was a year she would make a mess in the crate if she was left in it, but knew we were still home. After about a little less then her being a year old, she just all of a sudden stopped. And she hasn't had a problem since. To this day we still crate her everyday we work or go out, neither have the run of the house while we are gone, but there are never any accidents.

I know this is probably not what you want to hear, but you may just have to wait it out.....

Yeah, we definitely don't want this to continue for another 6 months or more, but it's good to know others have gone through it and the dogs have eventually gotten over it.

[laylalove]

My husband and I are going through the exact same thing-we are daily cleaning out the crate 2-3 times a day. Our pup Layla is 5 1/2 months and I really think that it is a case of seperation anxiety. She hasnt had an accident in the house for probley over 2 months and knows to go to the door when she has to go. She constantly has to know where we are when we are home and be everywhere we are-which is why I think she has the anxiety b/c she is so attached to us. She makes such a terrible mess and I always know Im in for it when I get home. We are going to borrow a video recorder and tape her to see what she does. I thank god its the summer so its easy to take the bottom of her crate outside and spray it down but I hope this doesnt continue into the winter!?! This has been a daily occurance of her messing up her crate since we have had her (got her at 7weeks)-EXCEPT for 1 month she was a perfect angel and made 2 accidents the entire time!!! So we dont know what happened to her then, but we know she can obviously hold it. She is the best dog that we have ever had except for her crate messing! Cant wait until she gets over it-I guess we just have to wait....I unfortunately am no help to you b/c we have tried everything that has been mentioned here. Anyway just wanted to let you know you are not alone! Best of luck-I know I am looking forward to walking into my house and it smelling good....Im getting parinoid our house smells!!!

[LovinRuby]

laylalove--it is good to know that we are not alone in our crate woes. All of my friends and family can't understand what is wrong with Ruby. They are all like, "My dog never messed in it's crate ever.... Usually dogs won't mess in a small space like that.... blah, blah, blah." They give us this attitude that we must be doing something wrong or that Ruby is a bad dog. She's a great puppy in every other way. We just have this one issue. It's just nice to hear that Ruby isn't the only puppy that doesn't follow the dog "rules" as far as not messing in a crate. I guess we just have to stay positive and hopeful that one day the messes will end.... they will, someday.... (I hope.)

[punkin]

Wow! After reading all of your posts, I am sure you must be nearly at your wits end. Here's my suggestion (for what it's worth).
I think you need to start over completely. Find a divider that makes the crate the right size for Ruby and put a nice (washable) pad in her crate. I use a Snozzy pad, and my dogs love it. It also washes up great. Lay on the floor with her and coax her into her crate with praise and the yummiest treats you can find. Praise her and talk to her softly until she settles. When she is relaxed, let her out for a play. For now, treats are only in the crate and when she potties outside. That's it! Remember that she will need to potty every time she wakes from a nap and about 15-30 minutes after she eats. You can also count on going out about every 3 hours at 15 weeks.
Next, I would work on getting her to sleep in the crate by either placing the crate on your bed (securely) or sleeping on the floor next to her. Same routine as before, but she only gets out to potty. Every time she wakes up, it's outside to potty so at night she is either in her crate or at her potty spot. Treats for both. Once she begins to settle at that, try putting her crate beside your bed. Don't give in!!
Next, work on crating in the daytime. I use a Kong in the crate stuffed with cookies / kibble and peanut butter. You can try yogurt, liverworst or many other treats. Give the Kong only in the crate during the day and every time she goes in. If she settles in the crate in the bedroom, keep it there during the day. Ignore the fussing, make sure she has pottied (both types) before going into her crate, give her a soft blanket (no toys) and leave the house. Start by returning in 10 min, 20 min, etc., let her out to pottie and praise when she has done well. If she has an accident, reduce the time you leave.
I know this sounds very difficult, so try it over a weekend when you can dedicate ALL of your time to crate training. If necessary, you might need to use doggy daycare for a week or two until she is crate trained. Be patient, praise her only for good behavior in the crate and pottying outside. Set her up so she will be successful. Good Luck!

[LovinRuby]

punkin--We have been trying to build up some kind of tolerance for her in the crate by putting her in there when we aren't actually leaving. The trainer from puppy class suggested putting her in and taking her out before she starts getting worked up, trying to build up her threshold. We're not making much progress with that method. We are up to about one minute with these "practice" sessions, but when it's for real, she's right back to crying as soon as we close the door to the house. Perhaps we should try your version of retraining her for the crate. We haven't actually left her in for more than two or three minutes when we've been home in quite some time. We have been letting her out before she starts to cry. Prior to trying this method, we had been trying to put her in while we ate dinner or while I did dishes, just for like 15-20 minutes while we were still there hoping to desensitize her to being in there and so she wouldn't always associate being in there with being alone. She would wail and fuss the whole time and sometimes she would actually pee from being so worked up just in that short amount of time. Grrrrrrrrrr, it's so frustrating. With the long Labor Day weekend right around the corner (for those of us here in the States) maybe we will have to spend the bulk of the weekend giving your suggestion a try.

[LovinRuby]

Well, we thought we might have had a small breakthrough on Tuesday. We did the usual morning routine and I put a frozen peanut butter Kong in the crate with Ruby and she only made a small (barely there) mess before my husband came home for lunch. He cleaned that up, took her outside, put her back in, left, the usual. When he came home at 5:00 the crate was dry and she had licked the Kong clean (first time ever she's done this!). We were celebrating.

Too bad the celebration didn't last as yesterday was right back to the usual mess both morning and afternoon. She barely touched the Kong too--well, it was covered in poo, so she probably didn't want to lick it. (I dunno, dogs do eat really gross things sometimes though!)

Anyway, back to square one.... sigh....

[LovinRuby]

Just an update: We're still having issues and don't seem to be making a lot of progress, but we did have a good evening two nights ago. My hubby and I went out for dinner so put her in the crate. We were gone one hour, ten minutes and she didn't mess!! This is only the second time we have come back to the clean, dry crate in two months. (We've left her for 45 min-hour before with no success.) Yay for small victories! She was right back to her usual poopy self the next day, but obviously she CAN do it... so we keep trying....