[Marimat]

Originally posted by pep0987
DO you think that they should say that whites/ should only be breed with plain boxers, or with any boxers, that of course meet the stanards.

No!

Because again, this is too simplistic (not you pep0987 but the idea itself)

It is already known that there are 2 kinds of plain boxers. And I don't mean genetically against phenotypically

It is now widely accepted that we have flashy plains and plain flashies depending on what population thay come out of.

In populations where most bredings are flashy/flashy even the plains are diluted as per Part 1. In these populations it is not uncommon to have so called "plain" boxers with unpigmented third eyelids for example. This should not happen in a plain population unless there has been significant dilution of melanin.

In other populations it would be unheard of to get a "plain" with unpigmented third eyelids.

Therefore we have undiluted and diluted plains as well. How are we going to tell which are safe to breed with a white?

Julie, I thought you might like this. I would like to see white boxers, be treated the same as there color mates. Tell me if this is true. I heard that the reason whites were banned in the first place was because they were seen easier, for police and war dogs???

That's one theory, probably true as far as the war aspect of it goes, but that's what they knew then and we know what we know now.

It's no good to look back and say that reason is irrelevant (which I think is where you are heading), and ignoring what are actually better reasons now.

What would be the purpose of allowing whites to be bred, but not allow them to be shown in conformation? Isn't that the whole point of conformation - to select the boxers that best fit the standard and evaluate their suitability to breed and carry on the breed?

I actually agree with this in principle but it's also a bit like putting the cart before the horse. What came first, breeding or confirmation?

Breeding did.

So the question to me is not what would be the point of disallowing whites from competition but what's the point of breeding them at all? If they are not a part of the standard how can they be used to improve the dogs produced with the standard in mind?

Tam is correct - the whole point of conformation is to select the boxers that best fit the standard and evaluate their suitability to breed and carry on the breed.

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We don't allow dogs with genetic problems to be bred. We have a list of maladies worldwide which we look for and cull by

Thyroid problems, heart problems, kidney problems, hip problems - reputable breeders wouldn't touch dogs affected with these things with a barge pole. Why should reputable breeders be asked to further the boxers problems?

We KNOW whites have problems, the best known and most widely talked about is deafness. We KNOW it. It's an undeniable truth. Why in the world should deafness as a genetic disease be even thought of being treated any differently?

The world is full of happy bitzas and pedigree dogs that will not be bred and never see a showring. White boxers are in that category. Let them be pets and companions. Let them work if they are able but leave them out of breeding and confirmation altogther - it's just another recipe for disaster.

If a white comes from an excellent gene pool, has no health defects, then what would the outcome be to use the white for breeding to enhance the flashiness in a litter. The reason I ask this is because I have heard of this being done, and me being a now breeder seeker I am curious if this should be an issue in my search.

Has it been BAER tested for unilateral deafness is the first thing that comes to mind. Because it won't be picked up in everyday life if it is only deaf in one ear and WILL perpetuate the problem

Increasing the flashiness in a litter is not a pre requisite for breeding anyway. Flashiness is still not required in ANY standard. There's simply no need to do it and any breeder that is neds to be seriously doubted as to motives.

I wouldn't go near a breeder that used whites for this reason and would firmly plant them in the UNreputable basket or even the BYB category. If you have heard of it being done, if it's against the code of ethics where you are and you know who it is, report them, that's your duty as a "breeder seeker"

End Part 3